Heather Grimshaw: Welcome to absence management perspectives, a DMEC podcast. The Disability Management Employer Coalition, or DMEC as we're known by most people, provides focused education, knowledge, and networking opportunities for absence and disability management professionals. DMEC has become a leading voice in the industry and represents onto more than 16,000 professionals from organizations of all sizes across the United States and Canada. This podcast series will focus on industry perspectives and provide the opportunity to delve more deeply into issues that affect DMEC members and the community as a whole. We're thrilled to have you with us and hope you will visit us@dmec.org to get a full picture of what we have to offer, from webinars and publications to conferences, certifications, and much more. Let's get started and meet the people behind the processes. Hello and welcome to absence management perspectives, a DMEC podcast. I'm Heather Grimshaw, communications manager for DMEC, and I'm here today with Terri Rhodes, DMEC's CEO and one of the two DMEC founders, Marcia Carruthers, to talk about the 30 year anniversary and how it all began. Sharon Coletta, cofounder, wasn't able to join us today, but we were able to get some of her comments in advance, and Marcia will be sharing some of her thoughts with us throughout this podcast. We will also be publishing articles to commemorate the anniversary, which we plan to celebrate in style during the annual conference August 1 through four in Denver. I'm going to hand things off to Terri, who will be facilitating the conversation and will provide context about the people who made this all possible.

Terri Rhodes: Yes, thank you, Heather. So I'm Terri Rhodes, the CEO of DMEC, and I have been in absence management my entire career, which has spanned more than three decades. I won't tell you how many more, but I am just thrilled today to be talking with Marcia Carruthers and getting the feedback from Sharon as well, to talk about DMEC. Marcia, would you like to introduce yourself?

Marcia Carruthers: Well, thank you, Terri. That was a great introduction. And I'm not only thrilled that you're our CEO, but you can't find people with the passion. You mentioned the word passion, and that's for sure. That's what got DMec started, and that's what kept DMec going. So anyway, thank you for being where you are right now and keeping this organization going, especially in light of COVID In terms of my background, like many people listening to this podcast, it was not a straight route. But once you look back on it, you said, oh, you would say oh, that makes a lot of sense in terms of how I got where I was. But my early years in my career were at UCSD and risk management, and that's where I had responsibility for a lot of the workers, comp, medical malpractice, some short and long term disability as well. And then I went on to become president of our local Rims chapter. And we modeled a lot of what we did at DMEC after Rims, the San Diego chapter. And I also got my associate in risk management certification then as well, decided that I needed to get a little more education. Went and got an MBA, and then went to work for Roar, which was bought out by DF Goodrich, but did benefits, and it was a fully self insured program. And that's where I met Sharon, and that's where we hatched our idea for DMEC. And then a couple years after that, I left, and I worked for EAP. So you can kind of see where my passions come from. But briefly, that's my background and what I brought to the table when we started DMEC.

Terri Rhodes: Thank you, Marcia. And you and I have talked about this many times, how DMEC was founded, the premise on which it was founded, to bring together disability management professionals in a concerted way, in a forum, and also an opportunity to network. And as this forum has grown, much in the same way has the profession grown into integrated absence. And we had the opportunity to meet again in March in person, which was so nice. And we heard from a few of the newcomers who hadn't ever been to a DMEC conference before, and they were talking about how much they appreciated the fact that the sessions were focused on their work, not general HR or human resource topics. And that's really a testament to the work that you and Sharon did when you founded DMEC. Could you share some of the details around the issues that you identified 30 years ago?

Terri Rhodes: Thank you, Marcia. As you were talking about all that, my brain was going back and like, oh, I remember that. Oh, I remember those early conversations. And as we talked a little bit earlier, we were trying to set the timeline for when we met. And I remember when DMEC was really trying to move towards a chapter model to basically get more members so that the message could be sent out about what we were all trying to do, because it made perfect sense. Integrated disability management makes perfect sense. Integrated absence management makes perfect sense. But because organizations are siloed and we don't always have the support that we need inside an organization, there was a lot of grassroots efforts that was done by you and Sharon, and that's how we met, when you were trying to put together the chapter. And, you know, I remember all the work that was being done and how many chapters you guys were opening up on a regular basis. And I just was wondering if maybe you'd like to talk a little bit about that grassroots effort and what you were thinking.

Terri Rhodes: When you look back, Marcia, is there anything you would have done differently besides doing everything at once? Getting married, raising teenagers, starting a new job? Would you have done anything differently with.

Marcia Carruthers: No, I've often thought that I should have done it earlier, and that was mostly because it was so personally rewarding for, you know, the timing wasn't right. It wouldn't have known. Like a lot of what's happened in terms of DMEC, timing has been critical. Some of the other frustrations, and I don't know if this ever would have changed, but we really wanted to partner with other organizations, and we had tried many times to find the right synergy, but there really either wasn't an opportunity or the scale or the vision wasn't compatible. And some of those organizations were SHRM, IBI, and RIMS, and there were a few other smaller organizations, but that was a little frustrating. But maybe it wasn't meant to be. I don't know. The third thing that I was thinking that is the increased promotion of the mental health aspects of disability claims. And it was really frustrating for me especially, that it couldn't move any faster, but society wasn't moving any faster. And to be honest with you, it took COVID to move the dial on that, which is kind of a sad statement. But I am certainly more hopeful now that that stigma is going away. And there's going to be some opportunities to incorporate some really good mental health practices to help employees get back to work and certainly be more productive. I had an opportunity to talk to Sharon a little bit about that idea, and because she's had some personal challenges herself, she really had some, what I'm going to say, new insight into it. And she said that she definitely would have pushed mental health more because she's got physical issues now and really a new appreciation of what's involved sort of from the inside out. And she said, one thing that really sticks in my mind is when you lose your ability to perform in life as you once did, then it truly affects your mental health, and it's really a loss of purpose. She said that a couple of times, and unfortunately, she understands that better. And it really doesn't matter what profession or job you have. Applicants really experience a great sense of emptiness and loss. And DMEC, through its mental health offering at a time when it really wasn't popular in the business world, but it was a way of reaching people who were, in her words, shut away and not just return to work, but compassion for their loss. And really, she said, I didn't give that much thought to it, for example, like in carpal tunnel cases and using assistive technology and bringing people back to work faster. But it was really more than that. So now it's a frustration with it and how to integrate it into the mental health part, into our model. And that was in the early years, but it has obviously gotten easier.

Terri Rhodes: It's gotten easier, Marcia, but we're still not there yet. You were the great champion for behavioral health, the term behavioral health, behavioral risk management, and really set the tone for us to continue. And it's been something that I've also championed following your retirement, and it's so important, and we can't lose it. And I think it's been really pushed to the forefront, like you said, because of COVID And so mental health plays such an important part to your physical health. And I think maybe now there's more realization about.

Marcia Carruthers: I think that's been DMEC's role from the very beginning, pushing ideas that were either ahead of their time or we knew were important, and people just didn't realize it. And so I think into the future, that's going to continue to be putting it in front of people and demonstrating the importance, and hopefully, eventually they can incorporate these things into their program.

Terri Rhodes: Yes, absolutely. Going to just switch gears a little bit here and talk. We've talked about this so much. But you mentioned DMEC being a volunteer organization early on and the work that you had to use the company photocopy machine to make copies for a meeting, and luckily, your employer supported it, so you could actually get paid your regular salary and try to get DMec off the ground. But I think just people knowing that, it really illustrates the unique passion and dedication that we all have at DMEC. And that's been something that you and Sharon instilled, and hopefully I do, too. As a leader, and that will be something that DMEC is kind of what we're known for, and that seems to be what we hear from our more than 16,000 professionals, that they feel like they belong to the DMEC family, that we found our people. What do you think it is about DMEC that engenders that type of feeling and connection?

Marcia Carruthers: Well, I don't know if it goes back to the passion part, but hugs have always been a big part. Certainly before COVID it was an integral part to DMEC. When we saw anybody that we knew, I used to say, know, I'll give you a handshake to begin with, but the second time I see you, I'm going to give you a. So I don't know if everybody was happy about that, but anyway, it was just how we felt, because we really did feel like a family, because we had so much in common with each other. And I think part of it, too, is because we all worked remotely. So it was really nice to see somebody in person. We've learned that over COVID after all these remote meetings, and it's just nice to see people in person. But I think it's also due to our volunteers, and the volunteers have been the lifeblood of DMEC from the very beginning. I mean, we were all volunteers in the very early years, let's put it that know, certainly at the conference, when all of us would get together, other organizations would hire a consultant to come in and put their people in at the conference desk. And of course, they were different people every year, and they didn't know anybody at the conference. We always had people that you knew there. So that's why I think it sort of felt like a family reunion or a class reunion or something like that, where you felt very comfortable, like as soon as you got there. And some of these big conferences, I know everyone appreciate that you don't know anybody or hardly know anybody, so it just makes it more comfortable. We certainly made it our point to recognize people who are repeats to our conferences. We did bag stuffing in the early years, and we had lots of volunteers for that. And even though it was work, it was a lot of fun to be together, lots of smiles along with the hugs. I think people would say that people at DMUc were approachable. They didn't have to worry about asking for help or if they had a comment or a question to anybody. That's so true.

Terri Rhodes: I mean, there have been a lot of people who have been very involved in the success of DMEC and supporting DMEC in so many different ways. And if you think years ago, you know, like you said, which was very important, we were really focused on return to work. And I think because the workers comp people were very focused on return to work. And so that gave us a common language. What do you think in terms of where we are today compared to 30 years ago, in terms of the absence management professional and their role?

Marcia Carruthers: Looking back and seeing where DMEc came from, I think we saw an opportunity and that we kind of seized on it. And we initially sort of found our niche, which in the early years, the Washington business group on health had a disability section, and we certainly went to their conferences and learned from them. We knew risk management portion of rims and the work on workers comp was a key part of what we did. So that. But we also realized that there were some missing pieces, and that I think we kind of filled in where other people weren't providing the tools and resources for all employers, not just very large employers, and because it just made sense. Everyone, whether you had six employees or 600,000 employees, you still needed what DMEC had to offer. And because we had an integrated model, it wasn't just the industrial side of things, it was the non industrial side. So we were putting it all together, and I think our innovation and our vision, adding in that behavioral risk component, talking about doing distance learning, remote learning, we had think tanks, how to do remote medical. There were all these concepts that we added to our little tool bag that we knew were either going to be important or were critical, just even setting up was amazing. How many companies didn't have a return to work program, even some very large ones. So we gave them the tools and resources in order to do that. And I think part of it was persistence. If we had listened to people in the early years where they said, this is a flash in the pan and it's not going to last very long, I guess we could have given up, but we didn't because we had that passion, and we felt strongly that it was important. And I think probably the other piece, and I'll toot our horns here, that it was a woman led organization, and that nurturing was a key part, especially in the early. And Sharon had a comment about that. She said, nurture was so important for us, baking cookies. We worked in a male dominated environment, and we had to get their attention. So we would do a presentation before the senior executives at roar, but we also brought cookies. So some women today, young women, would probably say, oh, that's a step backwards. But for us, it was just one of our marketing tools, and we wanted to get their attention. And did they remember that meeting? They certainly did, because they at least liked the cookies. The same kind of thing with DMEC itself. We felt that we had to go in and make that extra effort with DMEC in the early years in order to nurture it and to give it a good start.

Terri Rhodes: Yep, there was a lot of discussion that occurred within organizations about integrating disability and what needed to be done, and there still is. I think we still have some areas of improvement, but we've come a long way. I think kind of that missing piece still is that workers comp piece. While many organizations do integrate their workers comp, we still don't see those program integrations, which is kind of what we fought for early on, is to get all of the programs integrated. I know you don't have a crystal ball, but I wish you did. I wish I did. I'd love to hear what you think is coming for the future. And how do you think the role of DMEC will need to change if it does need to change in order to continue to support our members?

Marcia Carruthers: Well, I don't have a crystal ball, but I guess DMEC's role is how has always been, excuse me, to not only support our current needs, but to envision the future and find the next innovation. Wow.

Terri Rhodes: A lot, Marcia, and I so appreciate your time. I have one last question for you, and it's really geared know diversity of our membership. Why is an organization like DMEC important for people in all stages of their careers, in all different types of careers? So what do you think really helps us stand out to attract a more diverse membership?

Marcia Carruthers: Well, the future, first of all, depends on attracting and retaining younger employers as members of our organization. And I know a few years ago when we made the decision to disband the chapters, part of that was predicated on the fact that in the workforce now, people don't have an hour and a half at lunchtime to get in the car and go to a meeting. That's just not the way things work anymore. So it didn't make any sense for us to get our message out through chapters. But we have found other ways, this podcast being one of them, and also the certification program, the webinars, the conferences, because we need to meet the needs of our employer members. And our employer members continue to get younger and younger all the time, so we need to find ways to engage them. And I also think the new communities program, Terri, that you've launched is a great way to meet that need, and I look forward to seeing how that evolves. That's really important. Also, DMEC has been good about asking our members what they want and what they need. So I think continuing to ask them because that will change over time and then to try to respond to their needs. But let us not forget those of us who have a more mature approach to integration, who have had 30 plus years in the industry, because we want to retain that intellectual capital of seasoned and retired members. And really, first of all, not to lose sight of where we started this podcast is a good way of looking back and seeing how we got where we are. But what needs to be addressed and how past efforts are sometimes lessons for us. Things that we tried that didn't work and why they didn't work, we certainly can learn from that. And I would also add that our more seasoned members can be great mentors for new professionals because some things don't change. Trying to make your business case, trying to get the attention over your employees, coming up with innovative return to work programs. All of that can be helped by talking to somebody who's been through it before and has some good advice.

Terri Rhodes: Thank you, Marcia. I have enjoyed talking with you today like I do every time we have the opportunity to sit down and talk. But especially I wanted to thank you for your time and your insights today and looking forward to seeing you in Denver at the annual conference.

Marcia Carruthers: And I'm happy to be celebrating 30 years. That's wonderful.

Heather Grimshaw: This is Heather and I just wanted to thank you both for your time and such wonderful perspectives. And it's really impressive to hear the wealth of knowledge and that theme of passion all the way through. So very exciting. And congratulations on 30 years!